Lauren: Okay, here we go. Take two. So excited. This is if you guys don't know, this is like a kind of a two parter, I feel like, like, I feel like we began this story on Jen Casey's podcast, we're gonna share a link in the show notes as well for when it goes live. Hopefully, we'll plan to release them around the same time maybe. And now we're jumping into a part two conversation where I was on Jen's show, and now she's on mine, bringing her into the space with all of you Lovebirds who are so dedicated to your personal path of healing and expansion and growth. And like, man, sisters have been such a catalyst for me and Jen Casey is like the top sister on my list of women who I feel have changed my life. So I'm really honored and so excited to bring her on the show. Obviously, I'll record an intro prior to this, Jen, and share our beautiful story of having met and all of the things. Jen Casey, welcome to the Lauren of Love Podcast.
Jen: Thank you so much for having me. And this is, well I've been on your podcasts in the past. But I think this is the first time on the new iteration, the expanded, like, level three version of, of the show.
Lauren: It's so crazy, because I don't know if like, maybe you feel this way too. But like when you meet people in this conversation now, having met them in a podcast conversation before, it's like you get to see this whole evolution of self. So like, I feel like I'm meeting you here in this new place. And I feel like you're meeting me. And it's like, we've known each other for years. And it's just like, it's I don't know, it's just it's really special to have a deeper conversation. Because we've gone deeper, we've grown deeper together. Yeah, how long have you been on your personal development journey? If I were to ask you that question.
Jen: Hmm. That is an interesting framing. So from reading personal development books, probably when I began my first online business in 2011. But I mean, we're on this journey of life, man. We're always in it. No, but yeah, it's, there's been many evolutions throughout my life, as there has been for most people. And we're gonna we're gonna jam about some of that today, I think.
Lauren: I know, I'm so excited. I would really love to share if you can just kind of drop in and maybe from like your perspective, I would love to know, the entryway of your personal development journey was through money, right? And recognizing from a perspective of like, this is good for my business, this is working on myself it's going to expand my business, it's going to create more financial abundance. Has that dynamic in your inner work shifted over the years and how?
Jen: Hmm, absolutely. So funny enough, and really reflecting on this more recently. I'm pretty sure I hadn't started my business yet, but my very first personal development book was when I was still pursuing a career in theater, and I woke up one Sunday, and my mom had Oprah's Super Soul Sunday on so this is somewhere between 2008 and 2011. And normally, I would kind of watch it passively. But on this particular day, Don Miguel Ruiz was on. And whatever it was about him, the author of The Four Agreements, I was glued to the TV to the point where I was sitting with my butt on my feet, like sitting on my knees, inches away from the TV, hanging onto his every word. And I just remember thinking, "I don't know what he's doing what he's smoking, but I need some of that in my life." Like, that is what I want. That is what I need. I couldn't quite articulate or pinpoint what it was, but he just had this lightness about him. When he smiled, it was like joy emanated throughout his entire being. And I wanted to feel the way that he looked like he felt. And so like I again, I didn't read. I was not a reader. I didn't read personal development books at this point. I was still in college, and I went on Amazon and I bought The Four Agreements, and I was obsessed with it. I brought it with me absolutely everywhere. I read it cover to cover multiple times. And then whenever I would go into audition for musical theater stuff in the city, I used to have full blown panic attacks, and I didn't know what they were. I just remember thinking I don't know how people have the energy to go and do this every single day. I can only muster the energy to do this once a week because I would go into full fight or flight. So, I would lose control of like my bodily functions and like have to run to the bathroom and then I would have all this anxiety, I'm going to miss it because I'm in the bathroom. And so I started bringing The Four Agreements with me and read to get on the train, and then reading it prior to the audition and not talking to anybody. And that was what allowed me to sort of replace the scarcity and fear voice in my head and replace it with something that was way more grounded. And it really positively impacted the way that I felt going into those auditions.
So I would say that was sort of like the introduction. But it's so funny because like, getting this like Toltec shamanic wisdom, I didn't know what I was picking up, I didn't know how like full circle, that would be for me. And so then in 2011, I joined a network marketing company and one of their core values was, and vital behaviors, as they called it was to read personal development every single day. And so that was really when I started reading sort of the more typical things that you might find, under the personal development section, especially at that time is very, like masculine, very much about performance and high achievement and getting certain habits in. And so I started shifting away from the more sort of spiritual conversation around personal development, and began really reading and investing my time, energy and attention into things that were more linear, more structured. And as you were kind of asking, like more money driven. And it really became about, I am doing this for the sole purpose of monetary achievement. And if I haven't achieved certain monetary, or financial goals, therefore, I'm not doing enough personal development. And so I had this sort of like warped relationship with the way in which I came into self study? And, yeah, thankfully, that has massively evolved.
Yeah, that was really where it started. And I'm so grateful for that because it was, it was where it all began. That was like my jumping off point and it gave me so many things to hang on to. And we had mentioned on the episode that we did, on my show, just about sort of the energy of somebody, when they first come back from an event, they're first doing personal development, they just want to share it with everybody. And I remember reading a book about goals, and I wanted to sit down with every person in my life and help them figure out their 10 goals. And everyone was like, Jen, leave me the hell alone. "But you need goals too! That's why you're not achieving what you want." So I became like, that annoying person, I kind of dropped in a little bit more and was able to just focus on me.
Lauren: That's, you know, I think it's really important to remember, like, when you're, when you're so passionate about something, just like letting it embody within you, right, and like letting yourself cultivate and be in an embrace of what you're learning and having that be enough, you know, so that and also to having women now in this space of the inner work, where, you know, you've shifted more into studying with plant medicine and your like, more in like a feminine connection to the universe, and like really deepening right, like and coming back to those roots. Having women to do that with side by side, I feel like has been huge.
So for those of you don't know, right, like, maybe we can just get people up to speed about our connection. So Jen and I met, when we were really young, we were in college. And if you did not listen to Jen's podcast, I'll get you all the details here too. But please go listen to that other episode. Jen and I were on the subway, auditioning for colleges. And we were going into the city. And I was with my mom and she was with hers. And we just made a connection and just knew that we were both going to the same place. And we had this one brief moment in the universe, and then kind of just never saw each other again, until we were how old were we were we? This was after college. Right? So this was like, I would say, a year after we graduated. So we were like 23, maybe?
Jen: I believe it was early 2016. Like February or maybe like it might have been like December of 2015 or just that first because I remember I was leaving network marketing or kind of going back and forth about it at that time. And I was slowly making that transition. But I was still kind of hanging on to it. I remember you came over to my parents house. You took photos for me, we did like a brand photo shoot but I hadn't fully made the business coaching transition just yet. But I was starting to get clients and stuff. So yeah, we were we were little babies.
Lauren: We were little babies. And like I look at that now and just see, like we've been in plant medicine ceremonies where we get to sing together and it's really I'm coming to your house in a couple of weeks and we're going to record music. Like it feels like where we met and this universal connection has just kind of come full circle in a really cool way. And part of our study together sisters has been exploring plant medicine together. And I would love to hear maybe have you share a little bit about that transition in your life and what that medicine has done for you and what it's helped you with, I guess.
Jen: Oh my gosh, there's so much to unpack here. Love it, though. I love this conversation. I will start by saying the idea of plant medicine was not even remotely on my radar. I had never considered it. I had heard people mention Ayahuasca here and there, I had no idea what it was. All I knew at the time was that you threw up and I didn't understand any of the reasoning behind it, or the spiritual intention, as most people don't. And I guess it was like, 2019, where I had my first plant medicine experience, and I didn't really know what to expect. And I was completely blown away by the connectedness that I felt with oneness. And the joy that I got to experience with all the women that I was with, like you, like, just being there, and we're just like, wow, life is beautiful man. And I'm in the bathroom, looking at myself just kind of exploring. And I remember writing, I brought my notebook with me. And I wrote in my notebook, you're already there. It's already done. And I say that all the time now, that has become like my mantra. And I remember coming out of the bathroom being like, you guys. It's already done. We're already there. And we're especially when you're in the medicine, you just, you understand things beyond language on a deeper, more integrated level. The most simplistic thing that just somebody else is like okay. And everyone's like, whoa, dude, that's amazing.
So I had that experience and then I remember during that same experience, the next evening, I was laying on the ground, and I was feeling kind of out of it. And a friend of mine started talking and I didn't really know what channeling was at the time. But as she was talking and sort of weaving in and out of different topics, I was seeing her face change, like almost as if there was like a ghost face floating over hers. And I thought I was just seeing things because the first night I had a very visual experience with my eyes open. But this night, it was not that way. And I was looking around I remember going okay, coffee mug, looking normal. TV, looking normal. This person looking normal, holy crap, what the hell's happened to her face? Like, I just did not know what's going on. And I remember I looked at her and I said, I think you're channeling right now. I see. And she's like, Oh my God, what are you saying, you're freaking me out. Oh, my God. And I'm like, no, no, no, like, you're fine, you're fine, keep talking. And it was wild. Because I saw three distinct faces. One was like a fairy face. And when that fairy face would come in, she would start talking about more feminine energy type things. Then there was this Egyptian looking person. And when that person would come in, she would start talking about Jesus and pyramids and the alignment of pyramids and aliens. And then there was like a third face another male sort of face. And that had like a different topic. And I remember seeing the faces shift as the conversation shift. And that was sort of like my validation that I was actually seeing something legit that she was really channeling these different beings. And then I remember there was one moment where it really I was like, okay, there's no denying this where she was like, couldn't get her words out. And I saw all three faces trying to speak at once. She was she was like "ah!", and like, we were like, you're okay, you're okay. And she started crying. And it was because there's like so much coming through all at once. And I didn't remember like any of the stuff that she said the next day, but it was me and two other girls and there was the one channeling I was seeing and then the other like remembered every single thing that was said.
Lauren: Where was I for this?
Jen: You were asleep. Or you left early. I don't remember where you were, but you weren't there that night.
Lauren: I have a million questions about this. So like we need to circle back to this after the podcast. Very curious about the details of it. Yeah, that weekend was phenomenal. Like I feel like so many difficult so okay, so that happened for you once and then like is that medicine that like you can now work with in your day to day life? Has it come through?
Jen: So that was the beginning and the opening of me recognizing, acknowledging and validating the idea of channeling. Now I had been a fan of Abraham Hicks for a while so I was aware of what channeling was, but it never occurred to me that I want to say anybody could channel if they had the desire to to I don't know if that's actually the case. But I was also just beginning to open my channel. And so getting to witness somebody else channeling and have that sort of visual confirmation.
There was a part of me that wanted to go, well, this doesn't make any sense. This can't be real. I don't know what I just saw, I have no scientific explanation. And that I think, has been something that I've really been able to kind of untangle over the last two years, and come to terms with some shit you can't explain. But actually, like it doesn't just because you don't have context or language to explain, it doesn't mean it's not actually happening. And it's not very real. And you're not definitely seeing things. I remember even the first night, I was seeing a lot of like blue and or pink and purple, like vibrant neon pink and purple. I was not in a space I was familiar with. And I was just kind of looking around the walls and just random places. And then the next day, or maybe even that night, I was looking around all of the places where I was seeing pink and purple were outlets. And all around the TV. So anywhere there was electricity flowing, I was seeing vibrant pink and purple. And like, again, just these little things where I'm like, well, that doesn't actually make any sense. But now it really makes sense and holy shit. There's so many more gifts and so many more abilities that as human beings we are not told or taught we have access to, but are available to us at all times if we choose to begin exploring what they are or have somebody to guide us through that process. Yeah, that was like a huge awakening moment, that first journey experience of just seeing and then believing and validating myself of like, yes, this is what you saw. And this is legit.
Lauren: Wow, I have like, so much I want to dive into from this one little brief thing. So this is profound, right? Because the first question that's coming through that I want to talk about is the fact that when these gifts come on, especially in plant medicine style experience, it can feel kind of overwhelming. It can feel like holy shit, like what am I seeing? What holy, what? Like, you know, a very like, immensity. Like I know for me, one of my early ayahuasca experiences, the immensity of the energies that I was able to tap into just felt so foreign, that it almost felt scary. So did you navigate any of that? Did you face any of that energy, through that work of turning on your channel?
Jen: Thankfully, while I was in the moment of things, so there's been many ceremonies after we, I had shared very publicly about like, my experiences, my first Ayahuasca sit at Rhythmia, and all of that. I documented it all, all of us were like, let's document this in the podcast. And like pros and cons about it, I'm like, ultimately glad that I did. Because I think a lot of people got to kind of get a different perspective, it is all very personal, deep stuff. So I would say in those experiences, I felt very connected to the medicine, I felt very one with the medicine and there were certainly challenges and moments where I was unable to figure out what the messages were and just sort of like in this discomfort. And over time, I have learned the beauty of surrendering and like, not just being like, okay, fine, I surrender, no, actually fully surrendering. And that's really when all of the things will pass and all the purges will kind of move through. And I would say, one of the biggest transformational awakening experiences was pre-COVID when my energy gifts came through. And that was an insane night.
Lauren: Yeah, I remember that was like right before everything happened. Can you talk a little bit about what you experienced in that ceremony?
Jen: Yeah, well, I bring this one up, because that one was definitely a moment of like, what the fuck is happening? But in the best way. Like, I don't understand this doesn't make any sense. What is going on? What? So basically, I remember laying, just listening to music in this beautiful ceremony sit. And my hands sort of started moving, waving back and forth. And at first, I thought that it was just my hands sort of regulating or something because that had happened to me a few months prior in Ayahuasca, I asked her why she was moving my feet. And I asked her, What are you doing? And she said, you're not walking with your soul. And so she was, you know, making sure that I was one with my body. So my hands moving in a similar undulated way. I kind of chalked it up to that. And it was kind of annoying because I was just trying to rest my hand wouldn't stop moving and I had no control over my hand. And I kept trying to hold it down. And somebody kept pulling it up and it was uncomfortable to stop it from moving. And so I sat up, and I started almost conducting the room. And one of our friends Catherine was like, I thought you were painting? I thought you were like painting the room. And, and we talked about this on on an episode that we're sharing for on her show. So I'm like, I know she's cool with me sharing this. So literally she's like, I thought you're painting, you literally became a blue alien. And she was not on any medicines. So she's just seeing these things.
Lauren: I saw you as a blue alien to when this happened.
Jen: What? Okay, you never told me that.
Lauren: So many synchronicities to this keep going. This is so good. Yeah.
Jen: And I remember sitting up, and just having that moment of not necessarily fear, but the oh, fuck what the hell's happening to me moment. And I looked at one of other other friends and she just nodded at me so warmly. And I was just kind of looking at her like, okay, oh, you know, keep going. And she was like, yes, it's beautiful, keep going, okay. And so I'm moving my hands around the room. And I start to notice that when I do certain movements, certain people are moving. And I'm connected to certain people's energies. And I start moving my hand really, really, really, really fast. And it's like, Shakira booty shaking happening in the corner. Yeah. And then I'm like, oh, my God. So I stopped. And then the booty shaking stops, and then I started again. And then I'm like, What the fuck is going on? I think I'm doing this. Am I moving this energy right now? Like, how am I puppeting this right now? This is so weird. But my hands were just moving with without me like I was, something else was being channeled through me and basically guiding me through the process of how to do this energy work. And so I remember there was one point where I turned to my other side and somebody else was there. And I just was kind of moving something, fanning my hand above her kind of womb space. And I remember shaking my head really, like really intense shaking back and forth. And my one friend who was kind of watching the whole thing she said, after I thought you were not sure what to do, or you didn't know what you're doing. And I was like, no, I just in my head it was like, this is not hers. This is not hers. This is not hers. And I just felt like I pulled it out. And I instantly started sobbing and she simultaneously started sobbing.
Lauren: Yeah, I remember that.
Jen: I was like, holy shit. This is for real. Something crazy is happening.
Lauren: That was a moment for me where I was like, this work is real. Like, you think you know, right? Like you you maybe go with like somebody who's like not experienced perhaps a little Reiki or something. But like when you have somebody who's really connected to their channel and in plant medicine. Oh my god.
Jen: Yeah. And I remember, another friend was like, okay, can you do some on me? Sure. So I was like, doing energy work over her. And I remember seeing, like, she was just laid out on the ground with her arms spread open, just in full surrender. And I could see in my mind's eye, her veins were actually hands like if you take one hand and put it on your forearm and the other hand on your forearm, like hands like grasping for each other, and I saw that was in her veins. And it was like ancestors that were holding on. As I was, my as my hands were moving, I saw these, like vibrant blue water drops coming out of her and floating upward. And it was like, so cool. Meanwhile, I'm having conversations with somebody else. And like, my hands are going doing all this stuff. And I'm turning around talking to somebody else. What time is it? And she's like, how are you? Like, you're literally not even looking and your hands are still going.
The next day I woke up, oh my god, my arms have never been that sore because I was just literally flailing my arms around for like three and a half hours. Like I was so sore. And it was so insane. And then shortly after that, I hosted an in person event and I was able to, and again, I had no idea like what this was, I didn't know if I was gifted this, I didn't know if it just came through for that one night. I was hopeful that I would be able to like do it ongoing but I just didn't know and then I was working with one of my clients at that event, completely sober and wasn't on anything and it came through and I was able to give her quite a quite an experience. Life changing experience. And it was her right, like that my hands simply guide and help people recognize what the energies are but they have to choose to release it. And they have to be in that place of feeling safe and feeling able to like connect with your work.
Lauren: Yeah, this is, it's so crazy to like I'm thinking of the this whole story right. I remember this trip, I remember when your gifts turned on. I remember you literally moving your hand towards my hip. I was having, I was going through it that ceremony I was having like a deep tough time crying a lot and feeling so sick in my body. Your hand from across the room reached over and you started doing it and my hip was moving like crazy.
Jen: You were the Shakira.
Lauren: Yeah. And I literally had I looked at you and I said, not yet or not now. And your hand stopped and you went down, but like, you never remembered hearing me say that. It was like...
Jen: Oh, no, I do remember you saying that? Oh, I do. Because I remember you looked at me and you were like shaking your head like no, no, I don't want this. And I remember when we were all sitting down integrating after you guys were all kind of like teasing me like, damn, Jen. Like you're like, relentless. Like you were going for it. I'm like, you guys. In what world do you think that that was actually me? Like, we're, we're we're all here, right? Like, I was not in control of my hands at all. So like, your message was heard by spirit. And then you know, I was kind of like, okay, like, respect these boundaries or whatever. But yeah, like now I'm completely in control my hands when I do that. But that night, I was absolutely not. Yeah, I was 100% being trained in that. I don't even like to call it work. But I was being trained in that. And like, since then, I had worked with Shaman Derek and he just to kind of translate. Like, he helped me really just understand like, on a deeper level what these abilities are. And he asked me if I had a birthmark and I was like, what do you mean? He's like, not like a mole like a birthmark? And I said, yeah, I have like a coffee stain kind of birthmark. He goes, Okay, where is it? I said on my back. He's like, and where on your back? I'm like my lower back. He's like, okay, okay. And so apparently your birthmarks are like your healing abilities from past lives. And so he had me activate my birthmark. He's like, okay, so like activate your birthmark. And again, I instantly started sobbing, crying, and started getting all these visuals and started seeing myself in past lives, like, got the acknowledgement that yes, I had done this work previously.
And so the birthmark was just reawakening and remembering what I had already been part of, and that I was actually and I started start crying I didn't know why. He's like, what are you feeling? What are you seeing? I was seeing all these people around me and I could feel a tightness in my throat. And he was like, okay, ask this question, ask this, you know, kind of guiding me through the facilitation of this. And I was like, I was strangled. I was strangled for speaking about spiritual truths, sharing this work in the world, sharing these gifts. And so that was that was maybe like a year later.
But that was another huge like awakening moment of clearing all of that stuff from past life past generational stuff that was getting in the way for me actually being in the embodiment, because like, two years ago, I would not have been comfortable talking about this on a podcast, I was really just sort of, like, uncertain about it. And it was my own judgments and my own fears about it. It wasn't actually that anybody else, people have been 1,000% positive, I've literally not had a single person, give me negative feedback. And if I did, I literally would not care. Like, okay, that's fine. Like, do you man. But at that time, it was just so new for me. And it felt so like a little seedling of hope and I didn't want anybody to step on it. I just wanted to water it myself and figure it out and integrate it. And that took two years to really, or maybe a little bit less, but at least a year to really figure out what I wanted to say about it, how I wanted to share about it, what that meant for me, how I wanted to incorporate that into my client work, and all that.
Lauren: Yeah, there's a lot of elements of this and I think what's really brave about the process that you went through is giving yourself permission to kind of keep it close for a little while to really understand it before you got into a place of like being able to just be ready you know and in alignment and saying okay, like now I know now I get this so now I can like, it's cultivation, like at its finest. I think more people should be doing that. So first spirituality and just like coming into this place where you had this whole business, you had this whole, like, stand up stand on brand, right, that had nothing to do with him, you know, handwork, energy clearing none of that, and then realizing that you wanted to kind of start, how were you going to bring that in? What was that process like for you?
Jen: I think I'm still figuring that out to some degree. I definitely over the last two years have brought that into work with my clients, my one on one mastermind clients, and we've gotten to go really deep and had some really cool stuff happen especially in person events, and we do energy work together, massive clearings. And that is when I feel the most connected and most grounded and so whenever I come back to that, especially in person, I always have that thought of like, why the fuck am I not doing this more I need to be doing this like all the time, what the heck man. I don't, maybe somebody listening to this can resonate where you just spend most of your time doing stuff that you like maybe even love. But then you do something that is just the essence of you and requires no conscious effort, and it's just your fucking channeled bliss. And then you're like, okay, what, what, what am I doing? I'm still like, I do have so many things that I want to talk about and teach about and share and so many things that do bring me joy. And so now it's really just about this, this next evolution of still keeping some of the business stuff and having some of that stuff, probably more on Evergreen. And you know, I do love being able to coach and teach around sales and funnels and all that stuff.
But I definitely see sort of this transition sort of happening in my own business. And everybody goes through that to some degree, right, there's like this, especially for personal brands, it's you and so your brand and your business and your offerings are going to evolve and grow as you evolve and grow. And that something that can be really uncomfortable and fucking terrifying when you're like, I'm burning this shit to the ground, and we're starting over. That is not a fun place to be. But it's also the, the sometimes the necessary place like I certainly spent more time than I would like to admit, in resistance to getting to that place where I'm like, okay, acknowledgement, we are going to bring this to the ground, we are going to do whatever it takes to remold this, I know you've been as well, with kind of shifting the whole message and avatar and business and brand, it's like, oh my gosh, like, but I've gone through that multiple times, especially with the podcasts, changing the name of that. But it's like when it's not in alignment, you've got to listen to that. The misalignment feeling is not going away.
Lauren: Can we talk about too like misalignment and using your voice because I think that like, there's this whole component of like, we can walk away from things that are misaligned, but we could also speak our truth and like, express what's going on and what we're feeling and what's not serving us and like, be an advocate for ourselves through that. So yeah, that's just what's coming through as a powerful topic for us to dive into.
Jen: Yes, yeah, I saw a quote recently that said something to the effect of basically, like, are you misaligned with what you're doing? Or is it the way that you're doing it that's misaligned? Yeah. And I think that that's such an, I'm so glad you just brought that important nuance thing, right? Before you burn to the ground, really reflect on what's going on.
Lauren: Like, so for your journey of deepening your relationship with spiritual connection now, right, and growing a business at the same time, like, how are you doing it in a way that's, like, supportive and expansive? And, yeah, what does it look like for you now?
Jen: This is a big question. I think it's still evolving, I don't know that I'm fully to a place of honoring that entirely. And I just want to be 100 with you guys like there's, there's always something to, to expand into, right? I think right now, more recently, in January, I decided to take a beat. And I thought it was just gonna be maybe for a couple of days, I was just feeling really burnt out. I had some stuff happen end of December, basically had to work kind of through the holidays, and I didn't really get time off. So I was just really kind of feeling resentful of my business just wanted space from it, needed to just fully recharge, so that I could show up the way that I wanted to, because I was not I was not liking who I was. I was waking up that month towards the end, just feeling really cynical, like, most days. Like, what's the point of anything? Why am I even doing this like just cynical. And that's certainly not going to attract the things that I want to create. And I'm not going to enjoy what I'm doing if I'm just being a Debbie freakin downer. So I was like, okay, like, not that I needed to go in timeout. But I needed to go into like a, a timeout in the sense of like, away from my business so that I could recharge. So I said, okay, for this week, I'm not gonna do any on camera stuff, I'm going to give myself the chance to just be. I'm not going to make that an intention or goal. And I'll do some administrative stuff that has to get done. But other than that, if I need to sleep, I'm going to go sleep. If I need to go outside, I'm going to go outside, and just really, really the sleep thing was the main thing and just started really honoring whatever my body was communicating to me. And then one week turned into two weeks. And then by the third week, it was like, okay, I'm getting rid of coffee. I'm getting rid of alcohol. I am like, you know, being in spiritual ceremonial containers. And I didn't take the whole month of January off off, but I took a massive setback and was like really not working. And I needed that so badly, especially getting off of coffee, I did not realize how much that was affecting my ability to focus, my ability to think straight, it honestly felt like 100 tabs were open in my brain at all times. And as soon as I got off coffee, I remember first few days were so fucking miserable. Like, so. Like, why am I doing and then by day three, I woke up and I felt as like I was seeing through different eyes. I felt so present so awake, so aware, I started sleeping better. I you know, all the things, all the positive things. And so that's been a part of sort of reclaiming.
And I go through phases. There's times where I kind of get back into old patterns, and it's like, okay, hold on, we got to refocus again. And really refocus from the place of am I giving myself love? Am I nurturing myself is this nourishing? And we actually had a really beautiful call recently where you supported me and guided me and coached me and it was so amazing, and really just allowed me to kind of have that mirror. A lot of the things that I was sharing and expressing mirrored back to me around like what is that I want to create? What would bring me joy? And just really helped me like anchor back into what is the vision for 2022 and beyond and what do I want to create. I've also really started singing more. And I love that that's something that we've been able to share together. And oh, it's so crazy to think about just the expression of self and the nurturing of self. And I mean, there's so many things here, I started, I got a drum, I started drumming, and all the songs and weird, crazy stuff started coming through. One night, I couldn't sleep and instead of, you know, smoking weed, or getting up and pacing around the house and watching a movie or whatever, I decided to just sit in my office and drum and I recorded it. And at first it was really pretty and melodic. And then all of a sudden, it was just really intense. And just I was kind of cursing out like all these things, it just like, it was so cathartic. And then it kind of went pretty again. And then it got really weird. And I sent it to you about like, this whole song about we are spinning on a fucking rock and like, yeah, why are we stressed out about anything? Like nothing is real, like everything, it's whatever. And yeah, I feel like I've just been giving myself a lot of space and a lot of freedom to explore, and express in a lot of different ways. And actually listening to those nudges as they are coming through.
Lauren: Do you feel like honoring that within yourself, this is gold, you feel like honoring that within yourself has changed how you also express and honor your needs in the dynamics of other things? Like in your business, or in your relationship with your partner, or in your relationship with your friends, like you've been taking this channel of voice and learning how to use it to like, express yourself. Is that showing up in other ways?
Jen: I definitely think so. I mean, yeah, we it was so funny. My fiance edits my podcast. And the other day, I sat down and recorded three podcast episodes. And they flowed out of me so effortlessly. And I said to him afterwards, because we didn't get to see each other. He was working all day, and then I was podcast recording to like, late into the night. And so he was like, oh my God, I feel like I haven't seen you. And I was like, I have not been that open and like had that like just a clear channel, I don't think ever. I don't think I've ever sat down and just talked to no one and had it just flow out of me. So yeah, there's been a lot of little things like that, where there's been another layer kind of peeled away. That was sort of when I say layer, a blockage that was peeled away for my expression.
Another example is, I had a client who had taken my podcast name, like basically took it. And it was like, okay, this name, and also kind of copied my style of my intro. And you know, a couple months ago, my lawyer had sent a cease and desist, we were in the process of getting a registered trademark. And then we got the registered trademark. And I was like, do I send another letter? Like, what do I do? This is like, so weird. Like, she's literally been one of my longtime clients. And when we had sent that letter a couple of months ago, she changed it for like a week, then changed it back. And it's just like, I was like, feeling so uncomfortable. And I didn't want to say anything. But every time I saw that, I'm like this is why are you taking this, like you know what I mean. Like, there was this old wound, this old story around, like being taken advantage of. And so I was talking to one of my friends and she's like, you need to say something, you have to like, just, you know, you need to like I'm not telling anything you don't you know, already know, just like rip the band aid off. I'm like alright I'm going to do it today. And so I sent her a very, like loving and respectful message. And I was just like, kind of reiterated some of the things in the cease and desist. Like, you know, this is my intellectual property. We have the registered trademark, we're building this into a bigger brand. You can't like you know what I mean like, I don't even remember exactly what I said, because it was, you know, very brief and basically also kind of highlighted that there's, that creates confusion. Someone is going and searching my show and they're seeing both of our stuff. And then our little blurbs are almost exactly the same as well. I was like, it's pretty clear that one of them was copied so I don't think that that's something that you really want attached energetically to your brand. I know that you're very deep in the work of energetics and just basically was like, you know, I'm asking you again to please change it. And I didn't get a response. I didn't really expect one but I wasn't attached to the outcome of getting a response. And then I saw on her stories that she was changing her podcast and kind of framed it up of like, I'm so excited, we're having this new evolution. And I was like, that's fine, frame it however you want. But as of the day we're recording this it's still not changed, please guys do not go in, like do anything rude. That's not what I'm about. I'm not asking, I'm actually asking you to not go and look it up and do not do any kind of shady harassment shit, that is not what I'm about and I will be really pissed at you if you do that. I'm sharing this solely for the intention of my personal expression, this is my story, this something that happened, I have no hard feelings, I actually feel great. Now that I express it, I really don't care if she keeps it or not. It was really just about me standing up for my own stuff and standing up for myself, and really speaking my truth.
Lauren: Yeah, and I think too, like I can definitely relate to that experience of like needing to put your foot down and communicate your boundaries and like learning how to do that in a way that is loving and emotionally detached, right. And like, that's what I'm hearing from you too, because we can get like really wrapped up in the emotions around stuff. Like, I know you and I had long talks about this recently where I felt the need to express how sisters who were facilitating containers, like weren't really doing it in a safe way. And I had all of this fear around using my voice to express what I felt was like a really important thing to be said. And I think that's part of the navigation of learning how to turn your voice on, and learning how to actually have it be resonant in a frequency of love and in a frequency of honoring your boundaries and like a really good way. And not in a way that's like, messy or, you know, dramatic or crazy or chaotic and all of that. It's like, yeah, well, I feel like when you use this channel, through voice and you come to embrace it and accept it, in how it works for you for your own healing, you know how to use it to like, kind of play the game of reality a little bit better. Do you know I'm saying? Yeah, even how, you know, communicating with sisters to think that's such a big part.
Can we talk about using your voice in song, because we've been through, I think similar things, many girls grow up, they love to sing, right? It's like such a big thing. But then something weird kind of happens in our relationship with that channel, where we're kind of taught like, it has to sound a certain way, or it's good or bad or like, now you want to perform and get it right. So can you share a little bit about your journey in relationship with your own voice of song?
Jen: Yeah, so I would love to. Ever since I was a kid, I was celebrated for my voice, and got awards and all these things. And while that's all good and well, the thing that I kept hearing was you're so talented. And this is important. Because this created a subconscious belief. That one, you should only do things that you're naturally good at. And two, if you're naturally, if you're really truly naturally talented, then you shouldn't have to actually work hard for anything. And if you are working hard, then you must not be talented. And then if you sing and you don't sound good, then you must not be talented. So I had all of these freakin beliefs that I didn't really uncover until more recent years that were wrapped up in every single time that I sang. And so what was once pure bliss and joy became this really heavy, in my head, stuck in my rehearsal, got to get it right expression. And it wasn't purely channeled. There was like, two times. Meanwhile, now, like most of my stuff is like just channeled because I don't like I've cleared that you know, but I remember being in Stella Adler Studio of Acting, 2012. And I remember doing a monologue, and then my teacher I was like really connected, he was like, okay, start singing. And I was like sing what, and he was like umm... And I started singing Somewhere Over the Rainbow. And then I and he's like, okay, and now go into the monologue. And I went and whatever, he had me do this thing. And everybody was just mouth wide open, like, and I'm looking around, and I remember they were all like, holy shit. That was fucking amazing. And I'm like, I don't get it. I didn't do anything, though. And he was exactly, exactly, you didn't do anything. And I was like, I didn't get it. Like all I knew was, I felt really amazing. But I really didn't get it and what it was, was I was finally not in my fucking head. I was finally not trying to micromanage every single note that came through and I literally was in full surrender, full trust just allowing it to be expressed. And it was so connected and so easy and so effortless and divine in every way. And so present that yeah, it was was so impressive and so amazing because I literally didn't do anything. I just opened my channel and got out of my own way.
And so it's so interesting to think back on that and look at kind of where I've come to now, especially with singing and starting to sing in ceremony space, which oh, my god is like my favorite thing to do ever. I know for you too it's just like, literally pure bliss. And the first time that I sang in a ceremony space, I was terrified. And they said, does anybody else want to offer a song and there's like, 30 plus people there, and I was just like, dude, you're gonna regret this forever. Raise your fucking hand, raise your hand, like in my head, like, coaching myself. I raised my hand, and I'm like, okay, yeah, sure, oh, yeah, come on. So I start singing. And it was just like, I was literally trembling to the point where I got on all fours. I don't know what I was doing. But I was like undulating, like doing cat cow, as I'm singing. And I kept my eyes closed, and my hands were shaking. And I remember looking up, and I just saw you and our friend Cassidy. And you guys are like, oh my god, that was so beautiful.
Lauren: I was sobbing. I was sobbing. Anytime Jen sings in ceremony space, I cry. It's like such a whole process. Because it's really it's so beautiful, too. I think it's like to see how, you know, I met you in this environment where you walk into a room and like everybody is like in fight or flight nervousness, right? It's like this whole energy of like, I may be accepted to go to this college based on my voice and talent, I may not be, which means that I'm terrible. Oh, my god, this is the moment like, you know, it's like high pressure. And it creates kind of this, like restriction of that free expression energy, right. And seeing how I remember how I was holding that in those auditions, and then watching you and ceremony space, in your full freedom of voice and full freedom of expression, and you're hitting every single note, and it's like flowing and medicine and like, it's just, it's just beautiful, right? And like, that detachment of the I don't care what other people think of this, I'm like, just allowing this to run through. Like, I love watching you in that energy. It is like my favorite fucking thing. I could literally watch you on TV for like hours, seriously. Oh my god.
Jen: Well, I think what you just said is so beautiful and just potent. I think in the past, it was all about, let me impress these people, and then all that, like the fear of judgment, and it was such a performance put on. Whereas what I really learned from you, and so many of the people who are in their musicianship ship study who I've sat with, is that in those contexts and environments, it is not a performance, it is an offering. And that one idea has been so massively transformational in my life in my ability to express and the way in which I think about singing, after literally singing my whole life, private voice lessons, 10 plus years, every single week, going to different classes, and workshops, and studying in school, like all of these different things, and none of that, yeah, I learned how to breathe, I learned how to not be in my vocal fry. I learned about vowels. But, but nobody talked about, this is an offering, like a divine offering. We had all the technical, all the acting tips, all the ways in which to embody a character, but none that allowed you to just channel pure divine expression. And I just find that so fascinating/troubling that people like I'm like, how sad that so many people who are in that that is their life's work, that they may not be able to approach it from that lens and like that's, that's what it comes from when you're a kid. When you're just in your joy. My little niece loves to sing, hates when she's filmed though, so we have to be very sneaky about it. And we were out in the snow and she just started belting Let It Go. And she just went for it she just let it rip, the notes were just she started like screlting which is like scream belting at one point and like we are hysterical laughing. It was so pure, it was so like embodied. And yeah, I hope she holds on to that forever because that's that is the magic but yeah.
What I was gonna say is like I learned so much from just watching the way in which other musicians and the ceremony spaces approach the way in which they sing and that everybody is so supportive and that's such a unique thing that you really don't get in like musical, I mean, musical theater, people are supportive. But you know, you're, if you're competing with each other, and you're in the audition spaces, and like it just is a different energy. And I loved witnessing two specific things in ceremony spaces of singing. One, how everybody was allowed to come up, no matter what level of musicianship you were at, if you were like, literally just learning how to sing, or if you were the world's, like, next popstar, or whatever, it doesn't matter. And that everybody was celebrated for what they offered and acknowledged, even if they didn't hit a single note, quote, unquote, hit a single note intune, whatever that even means. It was like, whoa, when somebody was connected to what they were wanting to share, the notes didn't matter. And I think that's especially important, like for me, because I have, like, my ear is very good, which is great for some things, and also very inhibiting in other contexts, because it can be hard for me to sit through a show, if people are singing out of tune constantly, it's like physically painful. And yet, when I was in the medicine, it didn't matter, because those people were being truthful. And it was divinely connected. And that made it so pure, and I was getting chills, and I was loving it. And I wanted them to keep singing. And so it's really, really interesting to see how that has shifted and evolved, and just how much that connection and the the intention behind what is being expressed really makes it.
Lauren: Yeah, it's, there's something so beautiful about it. And I feel like one of the gifts of, and I speak for myself, but I'm pretty sure you might feel this way to, like the gifts of those containers of being in ceremonial space where like, the whole frequency is love for fucking eight hours, you know, and being in this dynamic of being super present, and being super connected to the heart and receiving. It's, like, so powerful to experience that and then have to take that home and have to like, you know, and get to bring that medicine home and like integrate right and find like, did your perspective of life start to shift after doing more of this work?
Jen: Oh, my god. Yeah, yeah, I'm not even remotely the same version of myself. I'm more myself now than I've ever been. And, you know, and it's been so cool to see especially like our whole sister group, and just so many of our friends, you know, who were in the study of themselves, really just becoming more of themselves and more free and more open and more fully expressed. And it's just so fucking cool to watch. And it's like, oh, my god, it's so great. And then like, one of our friends went to Peru, and came back and it's like, all these embodiment up levels. And you know, before she left us, like, oh, my god, like, who am I going to be? Am I going to different person and then I was like, oh, my god, like Happy Birthday kind of thing. Because you literally it's like a rebirth. When you go through some of these really transformational experiences.
Lauren: What would be your advice to a girl who wants to start using her voice more often or wants to start exploring her channels or her relationships to spirituality more?
Jen: Hmm. Allow whatever wants to come through, to come through without any judgment. And I say this, because I was actually helping one client, doing energy work with her. And I got a download from spirit that said, tell her that if she wants to start channeling light language, that she should do it, but tell her not to judge. So like, alright, this is for you. Like open your mouth. Like if you feel like light language wants come through. And she started like, like just channeling all this stuff. And that was like, such a transformational moment for her. And I didn't even know what that was. I didn't, I remember when I first heard that language, like what's coming through. So whether it's light language, whether it's your voice, whether it's spoken word, poetry, whatever it is, getting great space for yourself, to just let it come out. I feel like that's something that I've really been in a study with over the last year, especially being around you, our other friend Stephanie. One for like, I remember we were driving around Sedona. And she was like, I gotta, I gotta move something. And I was like, okay, and so she just starts growling and we're both in the car like, and we're doing energy stuff. And I'm like, and then we just started hysterically laughing we're like, this is insane and so beautiful and so hilarious, all at the same time. But I think in the early days, I was kind of held it in a little bit and tried to be like, you know, like, had to be like, really quiet. I didn't want to be the loud person in the room that isn't afraid to be looked at. And now I do not care. But that took a little while for me a lot to move through. But it's just like allow yourself to be fully expressed. So whatever that looks like for you, if you've been craving getting a drum or sound bowls, or I would say even get like a little like shaker, a little like $3 egg shaker and just start vocalizing and just let it come out. And it's not going to necessarily be pretty and it doesn't have to be pretty, it can just be raw expression. And I think that's just one of my favorite ways to clear energy to connect with myself to kind of get back in my body. And yeah, it's just so great for so many things.
Lauren: I love it. I love that we're on this path together. And I love that so much of what you shared is so resonant like every time you're talking and telling a story, I could think of a student of mine that is really going to benefit from this dialogue. So I'm so happy that we got to drop in, talk about all the magic medicine. And you are showing up in our Sacred Six Gigure Business Bootcamp, which I'm super pumped about coming on to talk sales strategy. I love it. I'm bringing, this is what so gets me so excited. I'm bringing in masters of strategy, who have these alter egos of deep spirituality that are just like igniting and turning on as we speak. So it's just such a juicy combination. And for everybody out there in the world who really resonated and connected and felt like your story was so special. Guys, please reach out to Jen. Jen, why don't you tell the world where they can find you?
Jen: Yeah, the world world you can find me at @heyjencasey, is my instagram handle, my website and then also the CEO Psyche Podcast. And we'll link up the episode that Lauren and I did because that one is so good. So definitely come and check that out as well.
Lauren: Yeah, thank you guys so much for being here. Jen, thank you so much for sharing so much of your life behind the scenes. And, you know, I hope for anybody listening, this just gives you permission to go a little bit deeper on your journey and to also embrace and love and accept where you are right now. Thank you guys so much for being here. Jen, we'll see you soon inside the boot camp.